new year new car gta v6 gt

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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby mettersl » Mon Apr 03, 2017 7:35 pm

I'm searching for a few bits to finish the project (this list will get bigger, don't worry) and I was wondering if anyone has spares of:-
1) the GTA sump temperature switch (not fitted to a610 ) three pin, goes in the rh side of the sump. Mine has got broken and only has one pin left. Seems to be important for cooling.
2) the wiring from the sump oil level sender to the engine loom. Two pin to three pin?

I'm sure there will be more...

I'm away or I'd put up some pictures.

If you can help, can you PM me?
Thanks
Lee
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby BIG_MVS » Mon Apr 03, 2017 8:21 pm

Look into my eyes not around the eyes....

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This is the part you need, you need it so badly you need to hit the buy it now.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/232265420254? ... 1555.l2649

3..2...1..Your'e back in the room.

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1994 A610 - Montana Red
Some GTA/A610 Parts For Sale:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/hertzvanhire/ ... pg=&_from=
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby mettersl » Mon Apr 03, 2017 9:56 pm

Well, that nearly worked...but what you have in the picture, I think I already have.
If the solenoid has the mounting plate and rubber mount on it, that could save a little fabrication, but I can't see the oil level sensor intermediate cable there,,..but I'll have another look when I'm back on the big screen.
Sadly no sump temperature sender either.... :angel
Cheers
Lee
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby simontaylor » Mon Apr 03, 2017 10:25 pm

sump temp sensor is not required.
When oil temp gets to 60 degrees, the fans come on.
Just bypass it. The fans will come on straight away.....and will rund for 3 mins when the ignition is turned off.
Well, thatshow a turbo car should react......but now I am thinking you have atmo ...... but JohnC will be along in good time to put us right :-)
1986 : '86 GTA v6 turbo, with Adaptronic ECU
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby mettersl » Tue Apr 04, 2017 7:45 am

Thanks Simon,
I'm away otherwise I'd be looking at the electrical manual too( but a look through last week at Rats didn't show up the wiring diagram in an 1988 electrical manual, but then I was in. Hurry and probabaly missed it). As you say, if it's a fan inhibit at 15 degrees and a fan on at 65, I'm sure the logic will be the same for atmo and turbo.
As it's a NLA...not even simon, item, I'll have to live with some kind of bodge unless I can find a switch. I'm sure it will be fine for the very occasional use this car is going to get.
As I have a dipstick, I'm sure the lack of the oil level gauge will be fine too, but I'm a sad obsessive engineer and like to keep it as original as I can and non working gauges irritate me.
Not needed for MOT and that's the current goal. That and opening windows.
Cheers
Lee
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby JohnC » Tue Apr 04, 2017 9:55 am

There appears to be some confusion between the operation of the sump oil temperature switch/sensor for the Atmo and Turbo.
Firstly the Atmo ........ This is a three wire sensor which has a single pole double throw center off type switch...... (ON..OFF..ON).
The Turbo, on the other hand .... according to the manual, as I have not seen one .... is a simple single pole single throw type switch ....... (ON..OFF)
The Atmo sensor is part of the "Anti Pollution and Accelerated Idle System" .... and nothing to do with any form of cooling, whereas the Turbo sensor has all to do with the "Engine Cooling Fan System".
You will not find any reference to either of these circuits in the Electrical Manuals, but there are good write-ups with diagrams on both systems in the main M.R. 273 manual ...... Atmo system on page B-41 ....... and the Turbo system on pages C-49 -50 -51.
However there is one confusing thing I have noticed ....... the switches are different in operation, but there is only one part number for these switches in the parts manual.
The Atmo ..... being the center off type, makes contact on one pole when the temperature drops below 15 degrees C, and will make contact with the other pole when the temperature exceeds 35 degrees C. Anywhere between these two temperstures the switch remains open circuit (OFF)
The Turbo ......being a simple ON...OFF switch, will only make contact when the temperature exceeds 60 degrees C.
I hope this helps to show the different switch operations between the Atmo and Turbo. :)

John
1990 GTA Atmo, 2003 Jaguar X type 2.5SE Auto, 2002 Daihatsu Sirion 1.3SE
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby simontaylor » Tue Apr 04, 2017 10:26 am

Yes, the Turbo car sump oil temp switch is a 2 pin unit.
1986 : '86 GTA v6 turbo, with Adaptronic ECU
Firsts at
2007 : Gurston Down & RAOC Champion
2008 : Rushmoor & Eelmoor & ACSMC Hillclimb class Champion
2009 : Longcross & Eelmoor
2010 : Crystal Palace & Eelmoor
2016 : Rushmoor & 5th O/A
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby mettersl » Tue Apr 04, 2017 6:17 pm

Thanks again John.
That means the car won't idle properly if the switch is broken and I need an Atmo sump three pin version too....
OK....


Swoons...
the parts manual is wrong...C'est impossible.... :silent
except for the other errors....

RHD handbrake cables sir...we didn't bother to mention they swap over for the roast beefs
Top of engine fan control thermostats for A610 and turbo...yeah, we got them the wrong way around...
Atmo carbs..only one version, or did we mean three? don't have the one listed? well that's unlucky if you want spares....

etc....

Anyway its all NLA now... :wave
Last edited by mettersl on Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby JohnC » Tue Apr 04, 2017 9:31 pm

mettersl wrote:That means the car won't idle properly if the switch is broken and I need an Atmo sump three pin version too....

No Lee ....... Without the sump sensor, the only thing that will not work is the Anti pollution control when starting the engine with oil temperatures below 15 degrees and above 35 degrees. This will not affect the idle.
However .... in our recent correspondence on PM's you said that the micro switch on the twin barrel linkage was broken ..... this is more important to put right as without it working, the engine might keep stalling when cold, until it warms up a bit.
Am I right in assuming you have not had a chance to read page B -41 of the manual yet ? That should explain all.

Top of engine thermostat for A610 and turbo...yeah, we got them the wrong way around...

Renault stopped producing the Atmo 88 degree thermostats quite some time ago but still produce the Turbo 86 degree ones with a jiggle valve incorporated .... which is a plus....... Pt No. 60 00 007 566 ...... I would not be bothered about the 2 degree difference between them ....... but if you want the original 88 degree Atmo one ..... Simon Auto did have them a while ago even after Renault had stopped stocking them.
1990 GTA Atmo, 2003 Jaguar X type 2.5SE Auto, 2002 Daihatsu Sirion 1.3SE
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby mettersl » Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:31 am

Hi john,
Useful to know about the water thermostats.
The m thermostats I was referrrring to are the engine bay fan control/overheat warning light on the turbo/610 where the parts book has them the wrong way around ...if you follow the parts book, the overheat light comes on before the fans start, which is a nonsense. Follow the manual and it all works.
Sounds like I need to understand what else is different on the Atmo before I go too far.
I promise to read the manual soon, I have been working on a couple of other things first to make space in my garage for the new toy. As the car is still being reassembled, it hasnt yet started so the fun will start then.
Thanks again

Lee
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby JohnC » Wed Apr 05, 2017 6:40 pm

mettersl wrote: ...........The m thermostats I was referrrring to are the engine bay fan control/overheat warning light on the turbo/610

How did we get on to the 610 on this GTA Atmo thread ... LOL .. ;)
1990 GTA Atmo, 2003 Jaguar X type 2.5SE Auto, 2002 Daihatsu Sirion 1.3SE
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby simontaylor » Wed Apr 05, 2017 9:41 pm

its called "progress" ???
1986 : '86 GTA v6 turbo, with Adaptronic ECU
Firsts at
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2008 : Rushmoor & Eelmoor & ACSMC Hillclimb class Champion
2009 : Longcross & Eelmoor
2010 : Crystal Palace & Eelmoor
2016 : Rushmoor & 5th O/A
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby mettersl » Wed Apr 05, 2017 10:57 pm

Deviation.(and a bit of attempted observational humour about the accuracy of the parts book and other documentation for these cars) mea culpa.
It's the pressure of finding all the bits....
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby clee » Thu Apr 06, 2017 8:25 am

Who's the Daddy !? You're my wife now ...It's just a matter of looking for something else in the piles and racks of shite here at RATS .....OK,the sump sensor is 2 pin but it's intact.I'll probably find a 3 pin when looking for a bolt .....
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Re: new year new car gta v6 gt

Postby mettersl » Thu Apr 06, 2017 3:30 pm

It's starting to look pretty....
Am I allowed to point out another mistake in the parts book?......the front GTA brake hose is 7704001956 (ren 25/ espace mk2 front, 440-465mm) for ABS and non-ABS cars.
I'm planning an ABS retrofit, so thought I'll buy ABS hoses from the start (7704001955-410mm) as described in the book, they start and finish at the same place, so it must avoid chafing the cables and both must fit but ....nope...brakes international to the rescue again...

If anyone can explain why ABS cars have shorter hoses I'd be interested to know. :angel :hang

Lee
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