RATS' Test Mule

A place to showcase your pride and joy

Moderators: eastlmark, BIG_MVS, Test Moderator

User avatar
User

phildini

Rank

Club Member

Club Member
Posts

1762

Joined

Sun Apr 18, 2004 10:00 am

Location

Epsom Surrey/ Venezia Italy


Has thanked: 7 times
Been thanked: 0 time

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby phildini » Thu Sep 12, 2013 9:33 pm

clee wrote:I see he's left that cushy Honda gig so will be even worse now ...still ...I think he owes me rather than the other way round ..One day and that day may never come .....


:lol: :lol: :lol: I have one in stock and I think it's all in one piece, not sure if it's bling enough for your bling bling Alpine though....... get "whats app" ill send you a pic, going to the lock up Sat to pick up bits for the tall guy 8)
Yes, BYE BYE Honda........Hello Classic Fine Italian Automobiles
84 R5 Le Car2 Turbo, 95 Clio 16V mk1, 68 Alfa Romeo 1750 GTV, 99 Mitsubishi Evo VI, 06 Porsche Boxster, 11 Lotus Evora S
no avatar
User

Alpineandy

Rank

Club Member

Club Member
Posts

2383

Joined

Mon Jun 14, 2004 8:37 am

Location

North Essex


Has thanked: 5 times
Been thanked: 10 times

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby Alpineandy » Tue Sep 17, 2013 12:58 pm

phildini wrote:Hello Classic Fine Italian Automobiles

You haven't got a job waxoiling have you???
Alpine A110, Renault Safrane 2.5dt, Hudson Kindred Spirit (Renault powered), transAlp (Honda) and Ducati Multistrada
User avatar
User

clee

Rank

Non Member

Posts

10406

Joined

Fri May 28, 2004 11:58 am

Location

Derbyshire


Has thanked: 53 times
Been thanked: 94 times

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby clee » Tue Sep 17, 2013 4:11 pm

Fiat polisher .....

Got to the bottom of the cut-out and as I thought ....shit in the fuel system .Cleared it all out and it seems OK now .How it got past the filters I dunno as was big flakes of red paint from the inside of my jerry can :evil: I thought it had all come out ages ago but seems not .Time to just bin it and get another .
User avatar
User

phildini

Rank

Club Member

Club Member
Posts

1762

Joined

Sun Apr 18, 2004 10:00 am

Location

Epsom Surrey/ Venezia Italy


Has thanked: 7 times
Been thanked: 0 time

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby phildini » Wed Sep 18, 2013 6:21 am

clee wrote:Fiat polisher .....Got to the bottom of the cut-out and as I thought ....shot in the fuel system ..


ARE YOU TAALKING TO MEEE 8) 8) ?? My 610 is running all good now, since i applied the strap on procedure....

Alfa Romeo Polisher xx
84 R5 Le Car2 Turbo, 95 Clio 16V mk1, 68 Alfa Romeo 1750 GTV, 99 Mitsubishi Evo VI, 06 Porsche Boxster, 11 Lotus Evora S
User avatar
User

JohnC

Rank

Club Member

Club Member
Posts

2159

Joined

Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:19 pm

Location

Jersey C.I.


Has thanked: 14 times
Been thanked: 79 times

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby JohnC » Wed Sep 18, 2013 7:15 pm

phildini wrote:My 610 is running all good now, since i applied the strap on procedure....

Hey Filippo...... there could well be a fix for this...... I am just waiting to see what Martin F found with Mr MVS's ECU at RATS last weekend...... it would be nice to know if they found something. :P
1990 GTA Atmo, 2003 Jaguar X type 2.5SE Auto, 2018 Kia Picanto GT-Line-S 1.25
User avatar
User

clee

Rank

Non Member

Posts

10406

Joined

Fri May 28, 2004 11:58 am

Location

Derbyshire


Has thanked: 53 times
Been thanked: 94 times

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby clee » Thu Sep 19, 2013 3:11 pm

I don't think any were looked at .Maybe next time he is up here .
Just got hold of a few more wiring manuals for 610 one of which is the RHD specific .Lots of diagrams and ?? things like the fuel and inj relays being on the lhs rather than the right as you look at the ecu :?: :?: Why would they do that ??

Has anyone asked he Frenchies if this is a known fault on the lhd cars ?? Might be worth doing that ......
User avatar
User

mettersl

Rank

Club Member

Club Member
Posts

1734

Joined

Sat Nov 13, 2004 12:46 pm

Location

Saffron Walden- North Essex


Has thanked: 14 times
Been thanked: 31 times

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby mettersl » Thu Sep 19, 2013 5:33 pm

I think some of the LHD/rhd stuff is because the used they same wiring loom for both and thats where the cable lengths go them too, that could explain the wiring. The abs wiring in the main manual is wrong for all cars the "RHD supplement"diagrams are quite different in some important areas, for both RHD and LHD.
All done on the cheap, hence the amount of hot melt glue in the construction of the interior parts.
My favourite is the centre console where there is wiring for a clock and illuminated ash tray, but the RHD cars the cables aren't long enough for the ash tray light (unless extended) and the clock is missing anyway.
You can hear them say "its only for the English, why bother" :shock:
User avatar
User

JohnC

Rank

Club Member

Club Member
Posts

2159

Joined

Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:19 pm

Location

Jersey C.I.


Has thanked: 14 times
Been thanked: 79 times

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby JohnC » Thu Sep 19, 2013 7:56 pm

clee wrote:I don't think any were looked at.... .

That is a crying shame... a real opportunity missed.... that saddens me. We are extreemely close, in my oponion, to finding a fix for this common 610 fault of cutting out. With the tests that Mr MVS and Mr Dini have done, a real solution could well have been found. :cry: :cry: :cry:
This fault appears to be heat related and with that in mind and a bit of lateral thinking, I looked at the fuel pump workings of the GTA turbo, and found that the priming and running of the fuel pumps.... (yes, plural, they are wired in parallel and thus run together even when priming).... are driven by pin 6 of the ECU. So my thinking is.... if you have a GTA Turbo and you have intermittent cutting out..... try the earth strap. However, one word of warning, you will need to identify the fuel pump relay by the ECU.... it is positioned below the ECU on the RHS..... and you will need to identify which pin goes from the relay to pin 6 of the ECU. On the '86 model year it is an Orange wire, and on the '87, '88, '89 and '90 model years, it is Brown.... Make sure model year is checked.
To me there is a possibility that somewhere along the curcuit from pin 6 of the ECU to the processor via the transistor and diode, and, of course the earth link from the transistor to earth, there is a crack in the print, a lead through, or a cracked/dry joint on the legs of the pins of the components, that opens up with the unit warming up, which.... possibly.... does not open up in the GTA,s case when the ECU is stood off from the bulkhead. Its just an idea at the moment, but worth considering should a GTA turbo have this fault.
I await being shot down in falmes. :lol:

clee wrote:Just got hold of a few more wiring manuals for 610 one of which is the RHD specific .Lots of diagrams and ?? things like the fuel and inj relays being on the lhs rather than the right as you look at the ecu :?: :?: Why would they do that ?? ......

Yes Lee, I have found that as well...... god knows why it is different.
1990 GTA Atmo, 2003 Jaguar X type 2.5SE Auto, 2018 Kia Picanto GT-Line-S 1.25
no avatar
User

MFaulks

Rank

Non Member

Posts

1581

Joined

Sun Sep 28, 2008 4:25 pm


Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 26 times

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby MFaulks » Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:33 pm

.
Sorry John, just the way the day went, BigM did mention his ecu, but it was more in passing than here's my ecu let's look at it; probably my fault as I was a bit tired and it didn't register. Please don't be sad about it, if BigM wants to post his ecu down to me for a few days next week I can drop it back off at Lee's next Friday as an option? I'll then get pictures, readings etc for you .. trying hard to make it up :-)
... A diamond is only a piece of coal that did well under pressure... PRV afflicted, may be I need to squeeze harder!!!!

https://www.facebook.com/maftecfaulks
User avatar
User

BIG_MVS

Rank

Club Member

Club Member
Posts

5228

Joined

Wed Jun 30, 2004 9:12 am

Location

Sandbach


Has thanked: 37 times
Been thanked: 68 times

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby BIG_MVS » Fri Sep 20, 2013 7:30 am

JohnC - Don't panic we will crack on with the testing. I did mention it to MartinF but I could tell he was a bit tired and wanted to chill out a bit. He didn't have the look of "lets get your ecu out MVS and have a play with it!" so I didn't push it.

However updated news is I have aquired another A610 ecu, it has an irish accent but don't hold that against it! I will try it this week in my car and report back. If it cuts out sans earth strap fix (patent pending) I'll send it off to either MartinF or JohnC for examination. If it doesn't cut out I'll send my old one off.
1994 A610 - Montana Red
Some GTA/A610 Parts For Sale:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/hertzvanhire/ ... pg=&_from=
User avatar
User

clee

Rank

Non Member

Posts

10406

Joined

Fri May 28, 2004 11:58 am

Location

Derbyshire


Has thanked: 53 times
Been thanked: 94 times

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby clee » Fri Sep 20, 2013 8:09 am

Try putting a higher amp relay in ,remove the strap and report back please .
no avatar
User

MFaulks

Rank

Non Member

Posts

1581

Joined

Sun Sep 28, 2008 4:25 pm


Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 26 times

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby MFaulks » Fri Sep 20, 2013 8:17 am

.
Good stuff, sorry wasn't deliberate, brain wasn't engaged. However, well done, and good on Mr. Says I guess. Recognising John's talents, and the fact he will be far more exhaustive, the word cams won't appear anywhere, and will do much better pics than me, I suggest you send your old one to John anyway Martin, you know it makes sense :-)
... A diamond is only a piece of coal that did well under pressure... PRV afflicted, may be I need to squeeze harder!!!!

https://www.facebook.com/maftecfaulks
User avatar
User

JohnC

Rank

Club Member

Club Member
Posts

2159

Joined

Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:19 pm

Location

Jersey C.I.


Has thanked: 14 times
Been thanked: 79 times

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby JohnC » Fri Sep 20, 2013 9:11 am

clee wrote:Try putting a higher amp relay in ,remove the strap and report back please .

Oh Lee...... I hate to do this..... but a Higher Amp Relay will not help. The only part of a higher amp relay that is different to the original is the Curent carrying capacity of its contacts.
It can't be the relay anyway, as with the strap connected which earths the coil, the pump works, so the relay must be working..... replacing it with an original or higher rated will not help the situation. Sorry.
I suspect you posed this question having read Mr Dini's action of replacing his original relay with a Higher Rated one....... the only thing was.... it still did not work, and he only got the engine started when he fitted the earth strap, rather proving the above.
Cheers
John
1990 GTA Atmo, 2003 Jaguar X type 2.5SE Auto, 2018 Kia Picanto GT-Line-S 1.25
User avatar
User

JohnC

Rank

Club Member

Club Member
Posts

2159

Joined

Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:19 pm

Location

Jersey C.I.


Has thanked: 14 times
Been thanked: 79 times

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby JohnC » Fri Sep 20, 2013 9:23 am

MFaulks wrote:.....I suggest you send your old one to John anyway Martin, you know it makes sense :-)

Quite happy to have a look...... but unfortunately I can't run the ECU over here as I would have wished, but I really would like to prove my theory or at least eliminate that possibility.
Just let me know what you decide to do Martin.

To Martin F...... yes I am still sad, but I will get over it ... given time. :lol: :lol: :lol:
1990 GTA Atmo, 2003 Jaguar X type 2.5SE Auto, 2018 Kia Picanto GT-Line-S 1.25
User avatar
User

clee

Rank

Non Member

Posts

10406

Joined

Fri May 28, 2004 11:58 am

Location

Derbyshire


Has thanked: 53 times
Been thanked: 94 times

Re: RATS' Test Mule

Postby clee » Fri Sep 20, 2013 11:59 am

JohnC wrote:
clee wrote:Try putting a higher amp relay in ,remove the strap and report back please .

Oh Lee...... I hate to do this..... but a Higher Amp Relay will not help. The only part of a higher amp relay that is different to the original is the Curent carrying capacity of its contacts.
It can't be the relay anyway, as with the strap connected which earths the coil, the pump works, so the relay must be working..... replacing it with an original or higher rated will not help the situation. Sorry.
I suspect you posed this question having read Mr Dini's action of replacing his original relay with a Higher Rated one....... the only thing was.... it still did not work, and he only got the engine started when he fitted the earth strap, rather proving the above.
Cheers
John



Don't feel sad again ...I don't mind being wrong or looking silly ....never had a big ego to feed :mrgreen:
The fuel pump relay when 'off ' flips the water pump relay timer bullocks so could this be in the mix ??
PreviousNext


  • Advertisement

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

Powered by phpBB ® | Renault' and 'Alpine' are trademarks of Renault S.A.S. or its subsidiaries and are used with kind permission of Renault France